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	<title>Comments on: Long dark winter of the MMO</title>
	<atom:link href="http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/</link>
	<description>MMOs and game design</description>
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		<title>By: Winter is breaking and spring is on the move! &#171; Bio Break</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16613</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Winter is breaking and spring is on the move! &#171; Bio Break]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Oct 2011 15:27:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16613</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] week ago Spinks wrote a thought-worthy post wondering if we&#8217;re currently in a &#8220;long dark winter of MMOs.&#8221;  In the article, she writes: &#8220;And as Winter is coming in real life (in the UK at any [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] week ago Spinks wrote a thought-worthy post wondering if we&#8217;re currently in a &#8220;long dark winter of MMOs.&#8221;  In the article, she writes: &#8220;And as Winter is coming in real life (in the UK at any [...]</p>
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		<title>By: spinks</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16602</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[spinks]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Oct 2011 04:36:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16602</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2011/QBlog231011A.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Richard Bartle was thinking&lt;/a&gt; along similar lines -- I think having all the virtual worlds in the hands of people whose main motive is profit has had the expected result really. And like you, I&#039;m sad to see what I would call virtual worlds die to gamification.

Especially since I don&#039;t believe it has to be all PvP all the time in a working virtual world. We&#039;ve just never had good MMO mechanics for anything other than fighting or the economy.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2011/QBlog231011A.html" rel="nofollow">Richard Bartle was thinking</a> along similar lines &#8212; I think having all the virtual worlds in the hands of people whose main motive is profit has had the expected result really. And like you, I&#8217;m sad to see what I would call virtual worlds die to gamification.</p>
<p>Especially since I don&#8217;t believe it has to be all PvP all the time in a working virtual world. We&#8217;ve just never had good MMO mechanics for anything other than fighting or the economy.</p>
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		<title>By: Wolfshead</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16601</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Wolfshead]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Oct 2011 01:52:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16601</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Very thoughtful article Spinks! I too have pondered whether the MMO industry seems to be headed toward an uncertain twilight. 

The problem as I see it is that the integrity of virtual worlds is being eroded by video game companies that are seeking to mainstream them and profit from them. Good game design shouldn&#039;t be motivated by the need to make money; it should be motivated by the desire to make a good game, a compelling world.

I wonder what companies like Blizzard and Zynga would do if they were given the task to recreate the ancient game of chess. I believe both of them would mutilate and dumb down the game for their own ends.

Even the notion of success has been changing. Now to be successful a MMO has to have millions of subscribers. People won&#039;t even consider lesser MMOs if they don&#039;t live up to the Blizzard WoW level of success.

All we can really hope for is that a time will come when technology will become so advanced that you won&#039;t have to spend $50 million to create a MMO. The problem is that the power is in too few hands right now which limits the choices and options for players.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very thoughtful article Spinks! I too have pondered whether the MMO industry seems to be headed toward an uncertain twilight. </p>
<p>The problem as I see it is that the integrity of virtual worlds is being eroded by video game companies that are seeking to mainstream them and profit from them. Good game design shouldn&#8217;t be motivated by the need to make money; it should be motivated by the desire to make a good game, a compelling world.</p>
<p>I wonder what companies like Blizzard and Zynga would do if they were given the task to recreate the ancient game of chess. I believe both of them would mutilate and dumb down the game for their own ends.</p>
<p>Even the notion of success has been changing. Now to be successful a MMO has to have millions of subscribers. People won&#8217;t even consider lesser MMOs if they don&#8217;t live up to the Blizzard WoW level of success.</p>
<p>All we can really hope for is that a time will come when technology will become so advanced that you won&#8217;t have to spend $50 million to create a MMO. The problem is that the power is in too few hands right now which limits the choices and options for players.</p>
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		<title>By: Tremayne</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16556</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tremayne]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Oct 2011 11:50:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16556</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;d say LOtRO was a success as a subscription-based game... and really it still is, the hybrid model they use is subscriptions for those who want to commit, and a way to play casually without a sub for thgose who might not do so otherwise.

Rather than the spring/summer/fall/winter model, I see the MMO industry more in terms of evolution. I think it&#039;s entirely possible that the WoW-alike dinosaur era is coming to an end, that they&#039;ve reached a tipping point of player apathy and boredom that is an extinction event for anything that reeks of &quot;WoW clone&quot;... which could be bad news for SW:ToR, Rift and Tera. The question is whether the mammals scurrying in the undergrowth will step into the empty niche and grow to achieve greater heights than the dinosaurs ever did, or if the extinction is just too big an event and takes the entire genre with it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d say LOtRO was a success as a subscription-based game&#8230; and really it still is, the hybrid model they use is subscriptions for those who want to commit, and a way to play casually without a sub for thgose who might not do so otherwise.</p>
<p>Rather than the spring/summer/fall/winter model, I see the MMO industry more in terms of evolution. I think it&#8217;s entirely possible that the WoW-alike dinosaur era is coming to an end, that they&#8217;ve reached a tipping point of player apathy and boredom that is an extinction event for anything that reeks of &#8220;WoW clone&#8221;&#8230; which could be bad news for SW:ToR, Rift and Tera. The question is whether the mammals scurrying in the undergrowth will step into the empty niche and grow to achieve greater heights than the dinosaurs ever did, or if the extinction is just too big an event and takes the entire genre with it.</p>
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		<title>By: Weekly Lagout &#171; A High Latency Life</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16548</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Weekly Lagout &#171; A High Latency Life]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Oct 2011 21:12:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16548</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] and Spinks have two interesting posts about the Death of MMO, it&#8217;s giving me something to think [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] and Spinks have two interesting posts about the Death of MMO, it&#8217;s giving me something to think [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Ardwulf</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16525</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ardwulf]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Oct 2011 05:15:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16525</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I love the application of the Ars Magica metaphor here; it&#039;s one of those things I ought to have come up with myself.  We played it almost exclusively for most of the last decade.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love the application of the Ars Magica metaphor here; it&#8217;s one of those things I ought to have come up with myself.  We played it almost exclusively for most of the last decade.</p>
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		<title>By: Tramell</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16518</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Tramell]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Oct 2011 16:08:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16518</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I know the press and a lot of players are pinning their hopes on SWTOR with all the recent MMOs going F2P and the growing trend of microtransactions. 

Change is coming and people quite frankly don&#039;t like it.

Having played SWTOR beta, I have to say some people may be left disappointed depending on their expectations. Guild Wars 2, I have enjoyed but there is still a lot we don&#039;t know about the game and of course, &quot;it&#039;s ready when it&#039;s done.&quot;

The field is static and if spending large amounts of money promotes similar gameplay to their predecessors, I can see recent titles becoming smaller in budget until breakthroughs are made and companies are willing to make the risk.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know the press and a lot of players are pinning their hopes on SWTOR with all the recent MMOs going F2P and the growing trend of microtransactions. </p>
<p>Change is coming and people quite frankly don&#8217;t like it.</p>
<p>Having played SWTOR beta, I have to say some people may be left disappointed depending on their expectations. Guild Wars 2, I have enjoyed but there is still a lot we don&#8217;t know about the game and of course, &#8220;it&#8217;s ready when it&#8217;s done.&#8221;</p>
<p>The field is static and if spending large amounts of money promotes similar gameplay to their predecessors, I can see recent titles becoming smaller in budget until breakthroughs are made and companies are willing to make the risk.</p>
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		<title>By: Killed in a Smiling Accident. &#187; Blog Archive &#187; O, wind, if winter comes, can spring be far behind?</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16511</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Killed in a Smiling Accident. &#187; Blog Archive &#187; O, wind, if winter comes, can spring be far behind?]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Oct 2011 11:00:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16511</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] the genre does indeed seem frozen to many of us who drift. With the onset of winter, the silence descends. The thunderous gods of the [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the genre does indeed seem frozen to many of us who drift. With the onset of winter, the silence descends. The thunderous gods of the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: West Karana » Daily Blogroll Oct 19: Time enough to learn to swim edition</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16510</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[West Karana » Daily Blogroll Oct 19: Time enough to learn to swim edition]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Oct 2011 10:01:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16510</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] Ars Magicka. Nowadays, even though every month brings dozens of new MMOs to market, she notes that bloggers are pinning their hopes on just SWTOR and Guild Wars 2 to bring them back to hardcore-ness; otherwise losing interest in the [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Ars Magicka. Nowadays, even though every month brings dozens of new MMOs to market, she notes that bloggers are pinning their hopes on just SWTOR and Guild Wars 2 to bring them back to hardcore-ness; otherwise losing interest in the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Asmiroth</title>
		<link>http://spinksville.wordpress.com/2011/10/19/long-dark-winter-of-the-mmo/#comment-16499</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Asmiroth]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Oct 2011 18:37:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://spinksville.wordpress.com/?p=5892#comment-16499</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I suppose it depends on the term AAA.  Is the subscription-based MMO dead?  Has there been a single one that succeeded after WoW and before Rift 6 months ago?  5 years without anything that survived more than a few months is telling in itself.  

To use your analogy, I think we&#039;re at the end of winter and moving into spring.  There are new takes on the MMO (TOR is not one of them) and the player market has shifted from &quot;play 6 hours, 4 nights a week&quot; to a more casual environment.

Instead of a saturated market with a small player base, games are changing their focus to accept any type of person, gamer or otherwise.  The player base is expanding from a couple million to a couple hundred million.  It&#039;s a cool place to be.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suppose it depends on the term AAA.  Is the subscription-based MMO dead?  Has there been a single one that succeeded after WoW and before Rift 6 months ago?  5 years without anything that survived more than a few months is telling in itself.  </p>
<p>To use your analogy, I think we&#8217;re at the end of winter and moving into spring.  There are new takes on the MMO (TOR is not one of them) and the player market has shifted from &#8220;play 6 hours, 4 nights a week&#8221; to a more casual environment.</p>
<p>Instead of a saturated market with a small player base, games are changing their focus to accept any type of person, gamer or otherwise.  The player base is expanding from a couple million to a couple hundred million.  It&#8217;s a cool place to be.</p>
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